Saving KITG

[KingMe]

I didn't know weather to make this a blog or a discussion so I just went with a discussion, maybe it will generate some feed back.

I see some people have a problem with the KITG becoming a subscription site, and we will probably lose some good contributors because of It. That being said, I think it is a great idea. Some seem to think that paying 20 bucks is a rip off , especially for a site that isn't constantly updated with a plethora of videos or whatever some people are looking for. I never really thought that was the purpose of this site though. KITG always seemed like a place where people can go to connected with others with similar interest, on a topic that is judged and ridiculed, or considered taboo or what not. This is a place where people can talk about this kind of shit and not worry about being judged for it, or be uncomfortable with that part of their own personality. If you want something to just get off to, there are plenty of other sites out there, all you have to do is google it.

I think making this site a subscription site is an opportunity to improve the over all quality of our site, as it will cut a lot of the bullshit profiles, trolls, and lurkers. Some of the stuff on this site varies from causal, strange, to down right fucking crazy, this is a ADULT site, so it will deter under age individuals from trying to sign up.

Out of the 6086 members there is only roughly a hundred or so that donate, and actually contribute to the site, and I know those people are worried that KITG will become a ghost town. That can only happen if YOU, the contributors, stop coming to the site. A community can never thrive and grow if there is no one to support it, same implies for KITG. This is your site as much as it is Mallory's and Dvhour's. What would be he point other wise?

20 bucks a year is nothing. That makes it what, $1.67 a month? I can find that in my couch most of the time. I think that we should be more focused on how we can make the site better from here on out, and come up with new ideas to improve the quality of our site.

[KingMe]

That is unfortunat sexxiigirl, because I'm sure they love giving you attention ;)

[G Reezik]

What about exclusive content for KITG? We'd have volunteers who are willing to donate their time and creativity to make APPROPRIATE content for here that could be purchased and the proceeds go to keeping this site free? We could make little skit videos or short films of encounters that focus on groin attacks whether they be comical,dramatic,suspenseful etc. All of those skits would have to be within a PG guideline and approved by a committee of volunteers before it could be up for purchase.

We could call the video shop "The Markickplace" Also advertising ideas could be comical like America's Funniest Home Videos in terms of how they're expressed. "Kicksclusive" videos aren't my only idea we could do photos that can only be seen here. To entice the volunteers we could give them let's say a 25% or 50% discount on Markickplace items? With the exception of of their own content they contributed because they of course made it.

Maybe some of the more tech savvy volunteers could make little flash games or apps that can only be accessed on here. Everything would belong solely to the KITG umbrella, any attempts of video or photo theft would be prohibited. We could also do more stuff like shirts,pins,posters when there would be enough money like some money would go to site maintenance and the rest would go towards merchandising because I'm sure there are companies who would make whatever we asked so long as we provided the funds.

Another idea I had was the "Kicksclusive videos" could be made into compilation DVD or Blu Rays since it would be all site original content we would only need permission from the contributors which we would already have because they'd agree to give us their content  

I've only just begun thinking up ideas I'm sure I'll have some more later on if any of these aren't good

[dvhour (Site Owner)]

@ G Reezik

I love your thinking and really really appreciate you thinking out of the box like this. The ideas are solid and we will carefully consider these ideas further with you or anyone else who wants to contribute some thoughts on this. Keep in mind though the BB producers like Damien or Bronson who get paid to do this come here to share videos for fun not for business the moment we become a BB bank who has to doll money out to the creators and the site it could become an uncomfortable situation... I mean I have no idea maybe it could be done properly but it worries me that a lot of bad feelings and awkwardness can happen when you try to work with friends and family. I loooove the idea of the Markickplace haha very clever and again maybe there could be something to that we can work out over time. We will be getting a KITG branded BB video area so maybe we can work from that. 

Mallory and I take your comments to heart, we are not the type of people that ignore constructive feedback. We appreciate the thoughtful process in which you constructed your points.  There are probably numerous ways to fundraise for this site. There's Knave, Fox&Wolf, Bronson, AW, Joe/Kat, WU and a slew of others who could potentially help out. This is something that has been explored but nothing came of it due to people have other things on their plate. Maybe someday it could work for us but now its not focused, maybe you can help with that? 

We have thought about girls doing audio... actually Mallory and I toyed with the idea of doing audio segments for the site but managing this site is literally like a full time job it seems so having spare time to work that out is a bit much for either of us at this time. As far as other gals doing audio... hmm thats a bit trickier, but when I get back to Canada I'll see if I can try some things. 

We have thought about advertising and maybe there are creative ways to do it... But there are several issues we have to contend with. 1.. A few years ago I tried to do an affiliate program with shoe, clothing, tech and a few other non kink ideas every single one of the vendors I reached out to rejected us. 2.. We are trying not to look or feel like other kink websites or like another BBTube with X-Rated ads and raunchy imagery. Thats one sure way to get kicked off our Parent Network NING and its a sure fire way to alienate the comfy cozy feel of this site and its membership. 

Mallory and I have full plates in our daily lives on top of managing this site. I mean yeah it took me a while to get to your post here because I'm too busy in my spare time fighting maligning comments made by people who wish to see us go a bad route. That takes a ton of energy and its draining. Its not easy for Mallory and I to think of everything so its soooooooo very helpful that someone like you is willing to help. At this time though as we transition to the subscription model we decided to try something different. We will see where it takes us. Maybe it will flop maybe it will be successful. We do not have a crystal ball but know that we do care about the site and what it represnts and what its true patrons think about its future. Lets keep building on this sir. We appreciate you very much. 

[G Reezik]

My idea for videos wouldn't jeopardize the original flow of videos being uploaded if anything it might introduce more people to trying to contribute content. Anyone would still be able to upload whatever they want so long as it's appropriate for the site in general but contributed videos for the "Markickplace" are only exclusive for helping the site. People may join hoping to have their future videos become a part of our exclusive video section when they upload their regular videos or if they want to privately submit demos to us we can see if there's potential in having them make exclusive content for helping the site. I have some potential scripts in mind I'd just need to find volunteers for acting them out and recording them. Exclusive audio and/or video interviews may be another possible idea. I'm working on a fiction story I'll post the link to it when I upload it and you can see if I'd be an appropriate contributor. I'm financially all set so I have no interest in trying to make money off of this I only want to see this community grow into a strong gathering of people who want a cozy place to be free of ridicule who enjoy what this place is really about and that's good ol' fashioned crotch attacks.

[Hurts!]

well you are one of the 1 in a million that still buy a CD then, be I am one of the few that will save 5k on expenses  a year your being ripped off but the music label, because only $2 out of the $30 you pay will GO to the artist, but that's your choice,

as for comparing it to video games, I was simply conparing it to a forum, there are plenty of bb forums out there another one that has been out their since the mid 90s who created the term ballbusting, and he has used his own cash and money to keep it running for almost 20 years. as I said before we all appropriate it. But if you can't afford to run your own site for others to use then simply don't run it at all rather then rely on members.  it's like starting your own business, and asking the clients to pay more for their items because you need more money to run the business, life doesn't work like that,

The problem is this site hasn't got anything different or to offer what other sites do, that will give you free content, all the videos here are on youtube, all the chat on the forums here can be on other femdom forums all you have to do is google.

As I predicted before 80% users here will be cut in 2 days time, the people that stay and pay for the subscription will get bored because no new people will come through and a lot of their friends they have been chatting to on here have left. and when the time comes around next year for money, you aint going to get over 100 donations this time because you won't have 100 members around to help it.

[Jessika K]

wow, 80% ? then that would leave 1200 members remaining, nice.

[dvhour (Site Owner)]

@Kingy

Look I'm framing your words and I'll use them as inspiration for next year this time. Hopefully your predictions are incorrect, I'm a humble person and don't have a clue what to expect but all I know is that we are doing the best we can. Maybe it will not work thats not the point the point is we tried free for 4 years and it didn't work for us so we are trying something else. I know Yoda I'm a member of his site and I honor him and the culture that he has built. Yes I value other forums like femaledom and kramtoad, they are not our competition. We are not doing this to be them or anyone else we are KITG and you should respect that. 

Honestly we are just trying something new... No one ever said it would succeed or that it will be masterful but again Mallory and I are just regular folks we just want to keep the site running. Nothing is set in stone we will adjust as we see how things unfold. You are massively hostile for no reason if you can't or wont afford being a member on this site then fine but trying to bring down the energy and slamming the good nature and intentions of the site owners is pure savagery man. Whats your angle? 

THIS IS A SOCIAL NETWORK not a forum or a regular site.. Our overhead is much larger than the sites you speak of we have terabytes of data lots and over 500 visitors daily. You have no idea what you are talking about. We tried to make this free and we asked for donations you saw that as a problem. Do you expect me and Mallory to come up with $800 dollars to promote  a free community for someone as ungrateful as you... You have the nerve to complain and not offer any suggestions and act like we are some kind of greedy users.... SERIOUSLY bro you are clearly showing your true colors and your energy isn't wanted here  all you are doing is bringing the vibe and culture down, so good riddance. 

[Foo Bar]

Sir - you have terabytes of OUR data, submitted freely by thousands of ordinary users.  Your planned enclosure and privatization of OUR data is grievous violation of the trust the user community placed in you.  That is the kindest way to phrase it.

One may also observe a consistent pattern of verbal abuse and bullying toward any who, now or in the past, have dared question your diktats.  You, sir, display a "massively hostile" attitude to the users who made this site what it is, or once was.

Fellow users, let us all learn a lesson from the impending death of KITG:  It is unwise to invest effort in, and contribute data to, a "community" governed by an unaccountable dictator. 

[Michael]

"terrabytes of OUR data" - so... I wonder, where are your terrabytes gone? Couldn't find them.

But I am sure that if you or anyone, who feels betrayed by the "dictatorship", politely asks to delete the content, that you gave away for everyone to download and keep as long as they want (keep in mind, you don't lose your content yourself, you can just like in real life not look into everybody's computer and see your data in their just because it came from you originally), from the website, it will be done. Besides that many of the videos and pictures were originally from people, who are not even part of this community, but uploaded here from people who got the files somewhere from the internet.

So if somebody is so pissed that he can not access his uploaded files here anymore, then just ask to have all your data deleted.

If you didn't understand it till now - this step is not something the owners of the website wanted to do originally, but it seems for them the best way to keep the website without having to pay everything out of their own pocket. And they neither claim to know that this is best nor do they plan to keep this forever this way.

That you yourself are truely abusive in using words like "dictatorship", you still have to learn as it seems. The admins are normally very respectful if the people addressing them are honestly and respectful themselves.

[Dave]

The no new members thing is the only drawback to the site going the subscription route. It's the only negative thing there is about the ordeal but it may very well be a huge, huge issue. They will be heavily deterred by a subscription no doubt as I would guess a good number of them stumble upon the site out of curiosity and a google search, perhaps a boyfriend or friend's refferal or maybe a mention or a link posted on another forum. I think many of the female members who have stopped by, decide to stay, participate, engage and socialize here moreso than they do on other sites similar in content because of the magnificant hands on job Mallory and DV do in moderating this place and keeping it upbeat, fun, friendly, welcoming and respectful.

So many of the other "free sites" are poulluted with rauchy ads, potential spyware and viruses and there is very little hands on moderation at all. Typically the owners just let the adds pay for the domain and if they can generate enough traffic from the video content uploaded they might even turn a profit. For the members of those sites, they go there, they put up with the adds and they get their video fix and move on with thier day with little or no true interaction at all.

I'm sure the female members of those sites are fewer and farther between than here and they are likely pestered, disrespected, harrassed, annoyed and put off by the male members far moreso than they would be here because that foolishness is something that DV and Mal have made it a point not to tolorate. I think that's what really makes this community different and what makes this site better.

For the yearly fee you could join members site where membership gives you free downloads and potentially pickup two or three hundred clips in those 30 days for your money, or you could go to a free site like ballbusting tube and stream thousands of videos at your convienience all year long...So What?

The "content" is not what compels me to donate here each year. If that were the case I would send my money direct to Wu or Joe and Kat or Damien or Wheezy or whomever. The content exclusive to KITG comes as a result of the "community" that Dvhour and Mallory have created. The interaction...the chats and discussions and friendships or acquaintences that are forged with other like minded people who share this unique and crazy fetish/hobby of ours comes as a result of the community than Mal and DV have established here and that sense of community is what sets us apart from the alternatives. That's why I donated. I believe in this site. I believe in the community they have created and the environment they uphold to keep this place a fun and engaging little spot to shoot the shit with like minded individuals on a topic that's a big part of who I am, yet remains supressed to most of my friends in the "real world".

I am by no means a rich man. I support a wife and two kids and live paycheck to paycheck like most people probably do. Christ, I overdid it on the family vactation a little last month and found myself recyclying my bottles for gas and smokes two days before payday to hold me over. That one recycling trip yeilded me $29.00. More than the cost of a years membership here. Payday came, life went on and I'm on to my next little family getaway tomorrow morning for the long weekend. In three years I've donated I believe $80 or $100 bucks total and I would love to be in a position to give more. I've probably exchaned less than 50 messages and watched somewhere between 1 and 2 hundred clips. I've probably chatted 50-100 times. My concern is not "getting my money's worth." I donate to the site because I believe in the cause and I support the community. I've never paid the fetlife subscription or donated to ballbustingtube because I don't really feel like a true "member" of those communities. This site is different. It's unique, it's far more interactive and engaging and I respect the fantastic job DV Hour and Mallory do and the effort they put in to keep it a float. I respect all of the members of had the pleasure to engage with over the years and I do believe I've made a few friends. If I don't log in but a dozen times in the next year, the site can count on me subscribing again next year because at some point I'm sure to have an extra 20 bucks floating around I can rob from the beer fund to support a community I believe in.

The lack of new members that will likely result, especially potentially curious would be new female members is no doubt an unforanate side effect of this new direction but the only reason it's come to this is because the support to do it any other way was simply not there. If we go down, we go down and if we continue to survive or thrive even better. At the end of the day DV and Mal have given us four great years of "community" and apparently without these measures, there would be no 5th so instead of just shutting down, they're trying something new. They'll continue to have my support and my membership as long as the site remains a float and I hope to see many of you on the other side so that our community can continue to soldier on and remain strong.

[KingMe]

Thank you Dave for voicing your opinion, I could not have said it any better myself. You are proof that there is still a chance for our site.

[dvhour (Site Owner)]

@Dave 

Dave your thoughts mean more to us than a donation. Its heartfelt and meaningful and its people like you and Nate who make this all feel worth it. There's a ton of resistance as you can see and a lot of hurt feelings and negativity and its not easy on myself or Mallory to have to contend with this. All we want and wanted for this site was it to be a respectable, collaborative and family atmosphere. It means something that you see the value in our efforts. The main reason why I even created this site was because I felt the BB community was lacking a PG-ratted, female friendly and socially responsible community that was divers and hell bent on protecting and supporting the BB Producers. I have been in this scene since 1999 I've seen pretty much everything out there on the Topic of BB I produced USBBonline and tried to make something special with that. Mallory has been into BB since 2009 when I accidentally invited her to the site... she was not into BB at all and was a strange concept for her but she came into her own and now she's probably more BB craving than I am at this point haha. Ummm honestly other than Sharon what other female Owners who you know that run a BB community or site and are genuinely active and social... UMMMM seriously I don't know of any other than Sharon from Femaledom. The key words here are ACTIVE and SOCIAL. Its nice that you grasp the intent of this site.. its not about the videos or the photos, they are a bonus we offer an experience. We offer A Cozy & Cheerful Ballbusting & Cbusting Social Network. This is our tagline and we stand by it and many people feel it which is why they contribute and spend time here. As i mentioned on another response... 

"The mentality of the BB culture has always been a dark, dungeony, CFNM, humiliation driven, callus, cold and distant solo kind of feeling. I'll be frank I prefer and purchase that content more than anything else. Actually thats all there is and thats the point. I embrace that side of BB, I enjoy the aspect of that kind of BB but its not the core of who I am. I am a masochist who's sensual... Many men are... yet the BB culture makes men to feel like they are losers, and pathetic and worthless and that they should be ashamed of loving it. Just look at the videos out there. Dominant, cold, abusive, callus women beating the fuck out of naked, sniveling, cowering, "creepy" men in a hood."

KITG offers the promise of both embracing and also deviating from this mentality by letting people know that BB is not ONLY about that and that it can be about intimacy and tenderness and sensual sexy fun or playful and silly fun or just a place to come and have a conversation about anything other than bb with like minded folks. ITs not about the videos and the photos that wasnt' the vision but hell this site has been home to some of the most amazing BB producers and artists this community has ever seen. That part is meaningful because it took a site like this to make them feel at home and comfy enough to share and engage with their peers. 

At any rate I recognize that you and others are not living high on the hog, Mallory and I are just modest folks ourselves so we can relate. We tried the please donate $1 for the entire year approach for two years and only 100 people took us up on that... We will try to find a happy medium and balance in the cost of this site moving forward, for now we are just going to see how this plays out. Its true we may not get new female members on this site however we do not know that for a fact, because on the list currently of donors a HUGE percentage of them are women and women are less than 1% of this site 6000+ men to about 400 women go figure. Plus nothing is set in stone we will continue to find smart ways to recruit and secure members. At any rate thanks again for your inspiring words of confidence. We sincerely appreciate you very much and thank you for bringing healthy energy to the site.